New York Giants Thread - Page 500

Mel Pipeher · 02-18-2021, 11:36 PM

He's Darren Waller if used correctly. I like that he would give Dimes a big target down the seam and in the redzone. This offense desperately needs height.

I prefer Pitts over the receivers. I don't think Pitts makes it to 11 but you never know.

Mel Pipeher · 02-18-2021, 11:38 PM

Cap floor is looking like 180 million

Gives teams some breathing room.

Zak · 02-19-2021, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mel Pipeher

He's Darren Waller if used correctly. I like that he would give Dimes a big target down the seam and in the redzone. This offense desperately needs height.

I prefer Pitts over the receivers. I don't think Pitts makes it to 11 but you never know.

You prefer Pitts over all the WR? If Chase fell to us I take him every time over Pitts.

scottyboy · 02-19-2021, 02:11 PM

I wouldn't want Pitts. I think the right team will utilize him well and he'd be a stud, but I don't think that's us. Chase won't fall. I love Waddle, but I don't think he's what we need. I'd love to get Chase.

I'm torn with us. How much do we trust our trio(?) of young tackles?If not, do we look at the Northwestern or USC kids?

Do we have something in Beal? The corners could be good value at 11. Do we think Rousseau is the answer to our pass rushing needs?

Our OL looked somewhat capable to end the season. I think Brad - Logan - Mckinney - Peppers make a really talented secondary. Adding Farley or Surtain could make it a massive strength.

I personally don't like Parsons, but I'm biased because PSU and he seems like a massive douchenozzle.

You gotta think before us is gonna be (in no order)
1) Lawrence
2) Fields
3) Wilson
4) Panini

We gotta hope Lance gets pushed up with that, after that, who knows? I don't see Chase falling, I'd be tempted to put him as a "no way". But after that, yeah, lots of ways the chips could fall

Zak · 02-19-2021, 02:23 PM

Beal is more likely to get cut than actually help the team.

scottyboy · 02-19-2021, 02:58 PM

Then honestly, I wouldn't hate a corner at pick 11. A couple good ones. Could snag a good WR in round 2 (Moore & Toney are good but small speedsters, Marshall would be cool to get), but we'd be neglecting our big hole at pass rush

Damix · 02-19-2021, 04:51 PM

I kind of rate needs as such:

Desperately need:
#1 Pass Rusher
#1 WR
#2 Corner

Need:
OL Depth
DL Depth (to replace DT/LW)
TE

Could use:
#2 ILB
Even more OL Depth

Between FA and the first two rounds of the draft we have to solve the desperately need category, FA will be telling what direction we'll go.

I'm still aboard the Rosseau bandwagon, if this was Reese still I think it'd be a lock.

We'll popularly mocked Basham in the 2nd, but I wouldn't gamble on him being there for us to pick.

We'll see, I probably came off as I hate Pitts on the last page, but I just don't have confidence we'll use him correctly + I'm still shell shocked on Engram

scottyboy · 02-19-2021, 04:58 PM

retweet what Damix said. I'd like Mitchell if he falls to the 2nd. Or a CB (Madison?)

If we're going pass rusher, I want to go big, ala Rosseau. No projects like Damontre Moore. Hell, sign Carl Lawson.

I'd love Golladay but feel he'll be tagged

Mel Pipeher · 02-20-2021, 12:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zak

You prefer Pitts over all the WR? If Chase fell to us I take him every time over Pitts.

Yeah, I do. Pitts is one of the top 5 best players in the draft. Didn't drop a pass in over 60 targets. Seam buster, he was unstoppable in the middle of the field. Nearly all his receptions were first downs or touchdowns. Just throw it up to him, he's too much of a mismatch. His only knock is blocking but he's improving.

I'm not big on drafting WRs in round 1, especially in the top 15. Never have been. I think our best bet is to get a vet WR in Free Agency. Would love it if it was Golladay but I think he gets tagged. Corey Davis works for me because I think he complements our receiving group and we don't break the bank.

Corey Davis and Kyle Pitts on top of Shepard, Slayton, and Barkley would give Dimes all the tools he needs.

Forenci · 02-20-2021, 09:14 AM

I think guard is probably the bigger need right now for us, but with the run on offensive tackles, I think we can get one of the top guards in the second round. Hernandez was pretty ass this year and Lemieux might be one of the worst players in the league. Maybe he improves, but with Zeitler also potentially being a cap casualty, I think guard is a high need. Tackles..man, Thomas did look good at the end of the year or at least improved. Everyone had him highly graded, so I think we'll just need to hope he improves and grows. Peart did well in the snaps he saw, so hopefully he develops too.

Build in the trenches and the secondary, find our franchise QB (whoever it may be) and then go from there.

The thing is, I think unless there are some breakout QB performances next year the draft class looks awful at the QB position. Rattler and Howell didn't impress me at all from what I saw. Rattler throws a beautiful ball, but he made some awful decisions too. Hoping Jones does well this year or we might be fucked.

Mel Pipeher · 02-20-2021, 03:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Forenci

I think guard is probably the bigger need right now for us, but with the run on offensive tackles, I think we can get one of the top guards in the second round. Hernandez was pretty ass this year and Lemieux might be one of the worst players in the league. Maybe he improves, but with Zeitler also potentially being a cap casualty, I think guard is a high need. Tackles..man, Thomas did look good at the end of the year or at least improved. Everyone had him highly graded, so I think we'll just need to hope he improves and grows. Peart did well in the snaps he saw, so hopefully he develops too.

Yeah, my focus is still on the oline but it's young so I'm trying to be patient. We had the second or third-fewest lineup changes over the course of the season and only improved marginally ranking as one of the worst pass-blocking teams.

We have to hope Thomas is a LT because of where he was drafted but he did not look like one. Peart was benched at the end of the season, that's not very promising but part of me thinks it was because of Covid. Peart and Hernandez both didn't play much after they got it.

Zeitler is good but not worth top 5 guard monies. Either extend him or trade him to a team that will extend him. Might get a 4th or 5th round pick. I also think they should try Hernandez at RG. I know he's never played it but he projects better there. Shane looked like shit in pass blocking but he wasn't bad as a run blocker and he had some chemistry with Thomas.

I think we should sign a vet with guard/tackle flexibility and draft a tackle early. We'll most likely miss on Slater (one of my favorites this year) and it may be too early for Darrisaw considering some of the qbs may push better talent to 11 so after thinking about it the second round is looking like the sweet spot for a tackle. Eichenberg, Cosmi, Little, or Trey Smith would be fine for me. Building the oline primarily through the draft while being patient with these young guys we invested in last year is the way to go for now.

Mel Pipeher · 02-20-2021, 03:52 PM

Dimes is the QB. They're going to continue to build around him for at least another year but I would spend some money on a backup with starter potential. Jacoby Brissett or Tyrod Taylor would be my targets. They have a similar style so the offense won't change much and they both protect the ball.

Forenci · 02-21-2021, 12:05 PM

Did Peart really get benched? I never thought he was starting, but I thought they were using an OLine rotation which is why he saw so many snaps for a backup tackle over the course of the season.

Mel Pipeher · 02-21-2021, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Forenci

Did Peart really get benched? I never thought he was starting, but I thought they were using an OLine rotation which is why he saw so many snaps for a backup tackle over the course of the season.

He wasn't starting but saw significant time in the rotation. He didn't play a snap in week 17 after getting his ass kicked against the ravens in only 15 plays then benched. Didn't play the week before that either against the browns. This all came after the entire oline got whooped against the cardinals.

Forenci · 02-22-2021, 02:50 PM

Good to know. To be fair, the Ravens do run an insanely complex defense with an amoeba style. Still, I think tackle could be a need for sure. Thomas could just be a right tackle, which would suck considering he made top 5 draft money, but I also think rookie tackles don't always have breakout seasons. I think this year will tell us a lot about our OLine with Thomas, Peart, Gates, etc.

Mel Pipeher · 02-24-2021, 11:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Forenci

Good to know. To be fair, the Ravens do run an insanely complex defense with an amoeba style. Still, I think tackle could be a need for sure. Thomas could just be a right tackle, which would suck considering he made top 5 draft money, but I also think rookie tackles don't always have breakout seasons. I think this year will tell us a lot about our OLine with Thomas, Peart, Gates, etc.

Thats true and he could end up turning out. I mean we all knew Peart was a project so I'm not trying to be too harsh on him or the group in general. They have a lot of growing and learning to do. Next year is going to tell us a lot about quite a few people. Judge, Dimes, the OL, Barkley, Gettleman.

Mel Pipeher · 02-26-2021, 02:33 PM

I haven't really considered the idea of keeping both Solder and Zeitler but what if we did?

Solder would have to agree to a pay cut and a move to RT. We could then extend Zeitler.

That would give us a line of Thomas-Lemieux/Hernandez-Gates-Zeitler-Solder with Peart as the backup swing tackle. Gives the young guys a little more time to develop and we can focus our attention on weapons in the passing game for Dimes.

Or do we just go with the young guys and use the cap space saved on other positions?

Zak · 02-26-2021, 02:53 PM

Solder and Zeitler will be cut to save money. Somehow our cap situation isn't all that great as it stands today even though we don't have much talent on the team.

Rumors that team isn't even close to a deal with LW either. Let him walk and re-sign Tomlinson and use the extra money to strengthen other spots like OL. Draft a real pass rusher in the 1st.

Forenci · 02-26-2021, 03:20 PM

Yeah. No way we can keep Zeitler or Solder with those cap issues. Maybe Zeitler if he restructures.

Zak is right though, and this is another reason Gettleman sucks, is that despite having weak talent we aren't in a good cap situation. Look at the Patriots, who finished with a better record, sitting with 60+ million in cap room.

Bradberry is taking up almost 20 million, but he's worth it. Solder and Zeitler eating about 20 million combined. Also, I know a lot of people like Blake Martinez, but he's not very good in coverage and really just does one thing well (tackle). At a position that's not very valuable (MLB) he's making WAY too much money. A very poor signing. There's also no way we can resign Leonard Williams, which sucks because he is talented and decently young at a premium position. If we cut Zeitler and Solder we probably could, but it puts us in a bind going forward.

Oh, and I think Golden Tate saves us 8 million in cap space if we cut him post-June 1st. That 100% needs to be done or Gettleman is fucking clown.

Damix · 02-26-2021, 03:51 PM

Eh, I don't agree with a lot of DG's moves, but overall I don't agree with some of the items you mentioned Forenci

Zeitler - he didn't sign him, he traded a bad contract he inherited (vernon) for him, and Zeitler has been our best OL in aggregate over the last two years.

Ideally we extend him to lower the cap hit a bit, but its a loss if we have to cut him.

Solder - yea its a bad deal, but we were absolutely desperate at LT and he was the best on the market. I don't think anyone thought he'd turn into a top 3 LT, so he would be overpaid, but that is fine with the expectation of average play which was super reasonable to be expected based on all accounts, no one could of seen him turning into just slightly better than Flowers rather than a major upgrade.

I put zero blame on Solder for opting out last year based on his and his families situation, but boy did it fuck us cap wise as he contract just moved forward a year and now we have to take bad hit releasing him (instead of this should be releasing him before the final year with much less dead money).

Martinez has his flaws but absolutely was a key piece to why our defense turned around.

Overall as much as I hate Raanan, he's right to the fact that while we shouldn't have a crazy FA shopping spree, there is plenty we can do with the cap to fit in anyone we want to add

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02-18-2021, 11:36 PM	#9981
Mel Pipeher Super Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2015 Posts: 1,468	He's Darren Waller if used correctly. I like that he would give Dimes a big target down the seam and in the redzone. This offense desperately needs height. I prefer Pitts over the receivers. I don't think Pitts makes it to 11 but you never know.

02-18-2021, 11:38 PM	#9982
Mel Pipeher Super Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2015 Posts: 1,468	Cap floor is looking like 180 million Gives teams some breathing room.

02-19-2021, 02:11 PM	#9984
scottyboy Super Senior Member Join Date: May 2015 Location: Stalking Brian Leonard Posts: 7,754	I wouldn't want Pitts. I think the right team will utilize him well and he'd be a stud, but I don't think that's us. Chase won't fall. I love Waddle, but I don't think he's what we need. I'd love to get Chase. I'm torn with us. How much do we trust our trio(?) of young tackles?If not, do we look at the Northwestern or USC kids? Do we have something in Beal? The corners could be good value at 11. Do we think Rousseau is the answer to our pass rushing needs? Our OL looked somewhat capable to end the season. I think Brad - Logan - Mckinney - Peppers make a really talented secondary. Adding Farley or Surtain could make it a massive strength. I personally don't like Parsons, but I'm biased because PSU and he seems like a massive douchenozzle. You gotta think before us is gonna be (in no order) 1) Lawrence 2) Fields 3) Wilson 4) Panini We gotta hope Lance gets pushed up with that, after that, who knows? I don't see Chase falling, I'd be tempted to put him as a "no way". But after that, yeah, lots of ways the chips could fall

02-19-2021, 02:23 PM	#9985
Zak LeBron James is a bitch Join Date: May 2015 Location: Jersey Posts: 15,813	Beal is more likely to get cut than actually help the team.

02-19-2021, 02:58 PM	#9986
scottyboy Super Senior Member Join Date: May 2015 Location: Stalking Brian Leonard Posts: 7,754	Then honestly, I wouldn't hate a corner at pick 11. A couple good ones. Could snag a good WR in round 2 (Moore & Toney are good but small speedsters, Marshall would be cool to get), but we'd be neglecting our big hole at pass rush

02-19-2021, 04:51 PM	#9987
Damix Dictator Join Date: May 2015 Posts: 5,776	I kind of rate needs as such: Desperately need: #1 Pass Rusher #1 WR #2 Corner Need: OL Depth DL Depth (to replace DT/LW) TE Could use: #2 ILB Even more OL Depth Between FA and the first two rounds of the draft we have to solve the desperately need category, FA will be telling what direction we'll go. I'm still aboard the Rosseau bandwagon, if this was Reese still I think it'd be a lock. We'll popularly mocked Basham in the 2nd, but I wouldn't gamble on him being there for us to pick. We'll see, I probably came off as I hate Pitts on the last page, but I just don't have confidence we'll use him correctly + I'm still shell shocked on Engram

02-19-2021, 04:58 PM	#9988
scottyboy Super Senior Member Join Date: May 2015 Location: Stalking Brian Leonard Posts: 7,754	retweet what Damix said. I'd like Mitchell if he falls to the 2nd. Or a CB (Madison?) If we're going pass rusher, I want to go big, ala Rosseau. No projects like Damontre Moore. Hell, sign Carl Lawson. I'd love Golladay but feel he'll be tagged

02-20-2021, 09:14 AM	#9990
Forenci Senior Member Join Date: May 2015 Posts: 662	I think guard is probably the bigger need right now for us, but with the run on offensive tackles, I think we can get one of the top guards in the second round. Hernandez was pretty ass this year and Lemieux might be one of the worst players in the league. Maybe he improves, but with Zeitler also potentially being a cap casualty, I think guard is a high need. Tackles..man, Thomas did look good at the end of the year or at least improved. Everyone had him highly graded, so I think we'll just need to hope he improves and grows. Peart did well in the snaps he saw, so hopefully he develops too. Build in the trenches and the secondary, find our franchise QB (whoever it may be) and then go from there. The thing is, I think unless there are some breakout QB performances next year the draft class looks awful at the QB position. Rattler and Howell didn't impress me at all from what I saw. Rattler throws a beautiful ball, but he made some awful decisions too. Hoping Jones does well this year or we might be fucked.

02-20-2021, 03:52 PM	#9992
Mel Pipeher Super Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2015 Posts: 1,468	Dimes is the QB. They're going to continue to build around him for at least another year but I would spend some money on a backup with starter potential. Jacoby Brissett or Tyrod Taylor would be my targets. They have a similar style so the offense won't change much and they both protect the ball.

02-21-2021, 12:05 PM	#9993
Forenci Senior Member Join Date: May 2015 Posts: 662	Did Peart really get benched? I never thought he was starting, but I thought they were using an OLine rotation which is why he saw so many snaps for a backup tackle over the course of the season.

02-22-2021, 02:50 PM	#9995
Forenci Senior Member Join Date: May 2015 Posts: 662	Good to know. To be fair, the Ravens do run an insanely complex defense with an amoeba style. Still, I think tackle could be a need for sure. Thomas could just be a right tackle, which would suck considering he made top 5 draft money, but I also think rookie tackles don't always have breakout seasons. I think this year will tell us a lot about our OLine with Thomas, Peart, Gates, etc.

02-26-2021, 02:33 PM	#9997
Mel Pipeher Super Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2015 Posts: 1,468	I haven't really considered the idea of keeping both Solder and Zeitler but what if we did? Solder would have to agree to a pay cut and a move to RT. We could then extend Zeitler. That would give us a line of Thomas-Lemieux/Hernandez-Gates-Zeitler-Solder with Peart as the backup swing tackle. Gives the young guys a little more time to develop and we can focus our attention on weapons in the passing game for Dimes. Or do we just go with the young guys and use the cap space saved on other positions?

02-26-2021, 02:53 PM	#9998
Zak LeBron James is a bitch Join Date: May 2015 Location: Jersey Posts: 15,813	Solder and Zeitler will be cut to save money. Somehow our cap situation isn't all that great as it stands today even though we don't have much talent on the team. Rumors that team isn't even close to a deal with LW either. Let him walk and re-sign Tomlinson and use the extra money to strengthen other spots like OL. Draft a real pass rusher in the 1st.

02-26-2021, 03:20 PM	#9999
Forenci Senior Member Join Date: May 2015 Posts: 662	Yeah. No way we can keep Zeitler or Solder with those cap issues. Maybe Zeitler if he restructures. Zak is right though, and this is another reason Gettleman sucks, is that despite having weak talent we aren't in a good cap situation. Look at the Patriots, who finished with a better record, sitting with 60+ million in cap room. Bradberry is taking up almost 20 million, but he's worth it. Solder and Zeitler eating about 20 million combined. Also, I know a lot of people like Blake Martinez, but he's not very good in coverage and really just does one thing well (tackle). At a position that's not very valuable (MLB) he's making WAY too much money. A very poor signing. There's also no way we can resign Leonard Williams, which sucks because he is talented and decently young at a premium position. If we cut Zeitler and Solder we probably could, but it puts us in a bind going forward. Oh, and I think Golden Tate saves us 8 million in cap space if we cut him post-June 1st. That 100% needs to be done or Gettleman is fucking clown.

02-26-2021, 03:51 PM	#10000
Damix Dictator Join Date: May 2015 Posts: 5,776	Eh, I don't agree with a lot of DG's moves, but overall I don't agree with some of the items you mentioned Forenci Zeitler - he didn't sign him, he traded a bad contract he inherited (vernon) for him, and Zeitler has been our best OL in aggregate over the last two years. Ideally we extend him to lower the cap hit a bit, but its a loss if we have to cut him. Solder - yea its a bad deal, but we were absolutely desperate at LT and he was the best on the market. I don't think anyone thought he'd turn into a top 3 LT, so he would be overpaid, but that is fine with the expectation of average play which was super reasonable to be expected based on all accounts, no one could of seen him turning into just slightly better than Flowers rather than a major upgrade. I put zero blame on Solder for opting out last year based on his and his families situation, but boy did it fuck us cap wise as he contract just moved forward a year and now we have to take bad hit releasing him (instead of this should be releasing him before the final year with much less dead money). Martinez has his flaws but absolutely was a key piece to why our defense turned around. Overall as much as I hate Raanan, he's right to the fact that while we shouldn't have a crazy FA shopping spree, there is plenty we can do with the cap to fit in anyone we want to add