Boxing Thread - Page 2

bigbluedefense · 05-20-2016, 03:53 PM

I like action as much as anyone else, but when it's the result of just awful defense, it's just eh.

I enjoy the strategy of boxing as much as the action itself.

nepg · 05-20-2016, 09:11 PM

I feel like you'd have to make way too many excuses and bring too many hypotheticals to the argument to really anoint Tyson as the GOAT.

TACKS · 05-20-2016, 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nepg

I feel like you'd have to make way too many excuses and bring too many hypotheticals to the argument to really anoint Tyson as the GOAT.

Not really. You'd just have to value peak dominance more than longevity.

bigbluedefense · 05-23-2016, 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TACKS

Not really. You'd just have to value peak dominance more than longevity.

This. Tyson before he went to jail and got rid of Rooney was the greatest boxer ever. I look at Tyson's career as basically 2 different people, pre-jail and post-jail. Post-jail Tyson had awful defense, relied too much on his power and stopped throwing combinations. He didn't have the footwork or the head movement that pre-jail Tyson had. Not even close. He lost his hunger and desire for boxing and just went through the motions.

But pre-jail Tyson was something we never saw before. Arguably the most powerful puncher we ever seen, his defense was unreal, his ability to get low and get inside bigger longer boxers was uncanny. His head movements and compact nature made it very difficult to get a clean hit on him. And he threw deadly combinations. His power and his ability to throw combinations made him so difficult to beat.

He really was unreal. Pre-jail Tyson mops the floor with Holyfeld or Lewis or anyone really.

Him vs Ali in a hypothetical fight would be so great but we obviously could never see it. I've seen every Tyson and every Ali fight, and it's very difficult for me to pick who was better, but I give a slight edge to Tyson. Mainly bc Ali didn't have his power.

R4L · 05-23-2016, 03:59 PM

Tyson is overrated imo

Rob S · 05-23-2016, 05:02 PM

There is no logical argument to be had for Tyson being the GOAT. But people who believe Tyson is the GOAT will never concede otherwise, so it's not worth arguing.

bigbluedefense · 05-23-2016, 05:12 PM

I'll die on this hill Rob. You can't convince me otherwise.

Who's everyone's top 5 favorite boxers? Mine:

1. Tyson
2. Ali
3. Hagler
4. Sugar Ray
5. Oscar De La Hoya

I know some names on there aren't the best of the best, but those were my personal favorites. I considered having Roy Jones on there, but I passed.

Rob S · 05-23-2016, 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigbluedefense

I'll die on this hill Rob. You can't convince me otherwise.

Exactly my point!

Rob S · 05-23-2016, 05:14 PM

And a personal top 5 is crazy hard. I'd have to give it some serious thought.

bigbluedefense · 05-23-2016, 05:17 PM

I can't name just 5 either, bc I liked so many fighters. I tried to stick to who's styles I appreciated the most.

I loved Tyson bc duh. I loved Ali bc his style was so unique. Hagler was just a bad man. Oscar broke the mold for Mexican boxers, he actually boxed, he didn't accept the stereotype that they all had to be brawlers. And Sugar Ray would go Super Sayan with the jabs and I just thought that was so cool.

R4L · 05-23-2016, 05:31 PM

Idk if I can even get to 5 tbh

De La Hoya is also overrated imo

Rob S · 05-23-2016, 05:32 PM

Oscar was the man. His talent is overrated among casual fans, but that guy fought everyone and it was usually crazy entertaining.

nepg · 05-23-2016, 05:33 PM

Haggler, Mickey Ward, Pernell Whittaker, Tyson, not sure on a fifth.

bigbluedefense · 05-23-2016, 05:37 PM

Yeah I'm by no means saying Oscar was a top 5 boxer, I just loved the guy. Fought everyone, stuck his chin out, had some great fights, and he was a pioneer in some ways with how he fought.

People forget how much crap he got from the Mexican community for a number of things he did. He didn't fight like how they wanted him to, he didn't box for Mexico, he got a lot of crap during his career.

When he beat the crap out of Chavez it was like a national tragedy.

Fernando · 05-23-2016, 05:59 PM

Mexicans mostly gave shit to Oscar because he was a pretty boy American born fighter that tried to draw the Mexican crowd. Mexican fighters are proud, arrogant and sluggers. Oscar was none of those and that's why he was criticized so much. Goes to the whole not rooting for two teams type of thing. He wanted to be Mexican so bad when he clearly wasn't.

bigbluedefense · 05-23-2016, 06:04 PM

Yup. You can argue though that even with all of those warts, he's still the greatest boxer of Mexican decent. I'm not ready to say that, I'd have to think about it, but you can make the argument for him.

Fernando · 05-23-2016, 06:10 PM

You can make that argument with Americans, but say that to a Mexican and prepare to get absolutely roasted.

bigbluedefense · 05-23-2016, 06:18 PM

Oh I know it. My guess is Chavez is the guy?

Rob S · 05-23-2016, 06:23 PM

Mexicans still bought his PPVs, that's for sure.

R4L · 05-23-2016, 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigbluedefense

Oh I know it. My guess is Chavez is the guy?

I'm not even Mexican and Chavez > De La Hoya.

De La Hoya's fight with Tito Trinidad is one of the funniest things I've ever seen.

Edit: My old man says Ruben Olivares in his opinion was the best Mexican boxer he's ever seen. Well before my time so I can't say I have an opinion on him.

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05-20-2016, 03:53 PM	#21
bigbluedefense LeBron James is a bitch Join Date: May 2015 Posts: 19,103	I like action as much as anyone else, but when it's the result of just awful defense, it's just eh. I enjoy the strategy of boxing as much as the action itself.

05-20-2016, 09:11 PM	#22
nepg LeBron James is a bitch Join Date: May 2015 Posts: 22,569	I feel like you'd have to make way too many excuses and bring too many hypotheticals to the argument to really anoint Tyson as the GOAT.

05-23-2016, 03:59 PM	#25
R4L Super Senior Member Join Date: May 2015 Location: LA Posts: 3,126	Tyson is overrated imo

05-23-2016, 05:02 PM	#26
Rob S LeBron James is a bitch Join Date: May 2015 Location: All the bacon and eggs you have Posts: 13,780	There is no logical argument to be had for Tyson being the GOAT. But people who believe Tyson is the GOAT will never concede otherwise, so it's not worth arguing.

05-23-2016, 05:12 PM	#27
bigbluedefense LeBron James is a bitch Join Date: May 2015 Posts: 19,103	I'll die on this hill Rob. You can't convince me otherwise. Who's everyone's top 5 favorite boxers? Mine: 1. Tyson 2. Ali 3. Hagler 4. Sugar Ray 5. Oscar De La Hoya I know some names on there aren't the best of the best, but those were my personal favorites. I considered having Roy Jones on there, but I passed.

05-23-2016, 05:14 PM	#29
Rob S LeBron James is a bitch Join Date: May 2015 Location: All the bacon and eggs you have Posts: 13,780	And a personal top 5 is crazy hard. I'd have to give it some serious thought.

05-23-2016, 05:17 PM	#30
bigbluedefense LeBron James is a bitch Join Date: May 2015 Posts: 19,103	I can't name just 5 either, bc I liked so many fighters. I tried to stick to who's styles I appreciated the most. I loved Tyson bc duh. I loved Ali bc his style was so unique. Hagler was just a bad man. Oscar broke the mold for Mexican boxers, he actually boxed, he didn't accept the stereotype that they all had to be brawlers. And Sugar Ray would go Super Sayan with the jabs and I just thought that was so cool.

05-23-2016, 05:31 PM	#31
R4L Super Senior Member Join Date: May 2015 Location: LA Posts: 3,126	Idk if I can even get to 5 tbh De La Hoya is also overrated imo

05-23-2016, 05:32 PM	#32
Rob S LeBron James is a bitch Join Date: May 2015 Location: All the bacon and eggs you have Posts: 13,780	Oscar was the man. His talent is overrated among casual fans, but that guy fought everyone and it was usually crazy entertaining.

05-23-2016, 05:33 PM	#33
nepg LeBron James is a bitch Join Date: May 2015 Posts: 22,569	Haggler, Mickey Ward, Pernell Whittaker, Tyson, not sure on a fifth.

05-23-2016, 05:37 PM	#34
bigbluedefense LeBron James is a bitch Join Date: May 2015 Posts: 19,103	Yeah I'm by no means saying Oscar was a top 5 boxer, I just loved the guy. Fought everyone, stuck his chin out, had some great fights, and he was a pioneer in some ways with how he fought. People forget how much crap he got from the Mexican community for a number of things he did. He didn't fight like how they wanted him to, he didn't box for Mexico, he got a lot of crap during his career. When he beat the crap out of Chavez it was like a national tragedy.

05-23-2016, 05:59 PM	#35
Fernando LeBron James is a bitch Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Texas Posts: 16,735	Mexicans mostly gave shit to Oscar because he was a pretty boy American born fighter that tried to draw the Mexican crowd. Mexican fighters are proud, arrogant and sluggers. Oscar was none of those and that's why he was criticized so much. Goes to the whole not rooting for two teams type of thing. He wanted to be Mexican so bad when he clearly wasn't.

05-23-2016, 06:04 PM	#36
bigbluedefense LeBron James is a bitch Join Date: May 2015 Posts: 19,103	Yup. You can argue though that even with all of those warts, he's still the greatest boxer of Mexican decent. I'm not ready to say that, I'd have to think about it, but you can make the argument for him.

05-23-2016, 06:10 PM	#37
Fernando LeBron James is a bitch Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Texas Posts: 16,735	You can make that argument with Americans, but say that to a Mexican and prepare to get absolutely roasted.

05-23-2016, 06:18 PM	#38
bigbluedefense LeBron James is a bitch Join Date: May 2015 Posts: 19,103	Oh I know it. My guess is Chavez is the guy?

05-23-2016, 06:23 PM	#39
Rob S LeBron James is a bitch Join Date: May 2015 Location: All the bacon and eggs you have Posts: 13,780	Mexicans still bought his PPVs, that's for sure.